Wow. Monday, after checking out the front pages, I was wondering where that one great page was ... everything just seemed ... okay. But that might be the best single page I've seen all year. Nice work, V-P.

Excuse the French, but that's bad ass.

V-P you inspire me.

That's a classic Pilot jaw-dropper. Awesome work. I could probably do without the big indents on the story, but that's such a minor nitpick ... and everything is so clean and simple. Gorgeous.

Very nice! Eloquent, poetic, appropriate. Very clever of C.A. to relate, perhaps the most infamous image of the days after, with the 5 strokes!
Well done simplicity in design makes me smile.

to borrow a phrase from guiness... brilliant.

i second kenney. i thought the new york times front was striking with the photo from above ground zero at dusk. then the v-p pulls this one together. it just shows how the simple and clean approach can deliver a powerful message and tone.

(applause)

Thanks so much for the wonderful compliments, folks. I've passed them along to the cooks.

Just for the record, though -- Stuart -- the page was cooked up by Sam Hundley and Deborah Withey. My only contribution was to collect a couple of quotes and send the PDF to NewsDesigner.

Thank you Charles! I just reread and came back to give credit where credit is due. Kudos Sam and Deborah!! Regardless, you all do an admireable job!
My aplogies

wow. brilliant idea! love it! simple and powerful.

my only criticism... what if it was hand draw instead of using illustrator? pencil perhaps enlarged 10000 times? it'd add a little more grit.

but still... brilliant. the v-p rules and breaking the rules. =)

Not to rain on anyone's parade because I do appreciate the value of the image but I used the 4 hash marks with a line through repeated in a print I did Fall 2001 re the event and a short time later realized that I had appropriated that image from a Cy Twombly drawing. Try stacking up multiples of the image many times and repeating sideways a few times and you have an abstraction of the people falling from the towers. It's not about five years and our obsessive memorialization of a day (many more people died on many other days in many other places) but a counting of the madness which continues to be wreaked.

Whatever, dude.
Just a thought though: You can do your political second-guessing and complaining about the current war any other of the 364 days of the year, but at least give the 3,000 people who were intentionally slaughtered that day their due.

Oh, my. How precious. No. Strike that. How pretentious.

It's a good thing you had an "ace" writer explain what you were trying to convey. At least we can hope he was able to do that. The image on the website is too small to be readable.

Are the four vertical lines supposed to be the twin towers times two? Or the number eleven twice?

Does the cross hash mark symbolize the removal of the twin towers by terrorists? And then the removal of the towers' debris by cleanup workers?
Taken literally, the immage as presented signifies the number ten.

The page's "911" label is even wrong.
Newsdesigner.com helpfully corrects it as "9-11." The public knows "911" as the number you dial for help in an emergency.

Maybe some designer should have made the call instead of proudly passing it around to his buds for the sought-after attaboys.

Readers would have appreciated it, I suspect.

Newspaper Reader, the four hash marks form the two towers (one hash marks either side of each tower).

In my opinion, it's quite a smart idea.

By the way, you spelled image wrong in your previous post. If you want to nit pick, website should be Web site, too.

FYI: Newspaper reader is obviously Wordhawk, noted design thread troll. Please ignore him.

Charles can i get a pdf of the wrap?

Incredibly clean, beautifully simple and stark. But I am also confused about headline 911+5. Since the infmaous day is almost universally referred to as 9 (slash) 11, why represent it as 911 (without the slash, which does more to evoke the number to call for an emergency than the day of terrorist attacks). Not trying to nitpick--I really do like this--but I was immediately preoccupied with that question upon seeing this. Just trying to understand the rationale for omitting the slash; Charles, Sam, Debra? Can you give us some insight? Thanks

I've been going back and forth with this page. I like the concept a lot and I got it right away. I think my problem with it is what Martin mentioned - the illustration.
Since it was done in Photoshop (or some other digital medium) it feels off to me. It feels like the image was created as a sketch to rough out the package - and was never revisited. For me, it's lacking the elegance I expect from the paper and the emotion I associate with the event.
I think that if the image had been rendered in pencil (or ink or charcoal, etc.) I would have liked it a lot more.

Not saying I'm right or wrong - it's just my two cents.

An amazing piece of visual storytelling and something to tug at the heartstrings of the readers.

Simply great.

Please let me make this clear: I don't mean to offend anyone with what I'm about to say. I'll give whole-hearted props to any paper that didn't use the tired cliche "Never Forget" as a main headline. And I'll give even more props to designers who manage to persuade their editors to embrace such a bold, daring concept. But this Page One is too abstract for me. To drop the nameplate and replace it with six-point type is rather counterintuitive. It almost implies -- in my own tiny opinion -- that the paper doesn't want to take credit or associate itself with the illustration. The hash marks really do leave too much room for interpretation, and Poynter folks SWEAR that human faces usually elicit more reaction than illustrations.
That said, I love the V-P, and I still think that -- in it's own way -- the layout is evocative and poignant. No flames, please. Just showing love and a different opinion.

Okay, okay. (Or should it be ok, ok?)

I'm a NEWSPAPER READER. Not an ad designer. Not a billboard artist. Not a blogger.

Thank you for graciously pointing out my typos in my earlier message.

If I had an editor (like you people SHOULD have) I wouldn't not have misspelled "immage." And I'm sorry I did not know how to correctly refer to "Web site."

But I'm a NEWSPAPER READER. I'm a subscriber to two dailies, one weekly, one monthly and one weekly freebie (which I read and appreciate, even though I don't PAY for it.)_

I roll my eyes when I see a front page turned into a giant INDEX to a thin, thin product. (ATTN: Rockford Register Star...I see you when I travel to N. Illinois to visit my inlaws. And Orange County Register, I've seen you, too.)

I shake my head when I see newspapers surrender section fronts to advertising (or to wrap-around adveertising that I have to peel off to find the news.)

And that brings me to that goofy, slash-marked "5" I commented on last night.

It confused me. It utterly failed to brand the newspaper it fronted. It did nothing to advance the news to readers.

How many readers dismissed that page as an ad and peeled it off (along with page 2 and pages 15 and 16 of that section) and tossed it (or recycled it, as we do out here)?

The iconic post-9/11 image (that's the correct spelling of "image," I hope) depicts two searchlights aimed to the sky to symbolize the twin towers.

This very website (Web site) depicts a cropped version of that haunting picture..(scroll down, I think it's the Chicago Sun Times).

Those are two vertical beams, not four as depicted on the front page we're talking about.

If any page designer has bothered to read this far down a long, WORD-filled post from a non-designer, let me only plead: Please think about the reader.

Tnat woould be me -- a NEWSPAPER READER.

Yeah, I'm agree with newspaper reader, is amazing for the designer eyes, but confuse for newspapers readers, simple like that, I know, look amazing for a Art Gallery or for SND contest, but not for readers, try to understand this point, is important you work for readers not for yourself, I like, is clever but, rememeber everybody have different eyes and different opinion and we have to respect every opinion. 911+5= 916 that's mean?

Though there is already a space in between the 2nd and 3rd hash marks, if the space had been widened maybe the symbolism would have been more obvious.

As one of the denser brands of readers (being a designer does not really help me in this regard) I looked at it and thought, "Hmm, 5. 5 years. Hash marks. . .like someone would do on the wall of a prison cell. We are imprisoned since 9/11."

Then I read Charles' commetnary, and kept looking at the illo, read some comments and THEN. . .bam. Two towers (each side is drawn, and there's a space in the middle) with a diagonal line, darker at the end, suggesting motion -- holy crap, it's the plane going through the tower.

THEN I got it. But you know what? It took me a little bit too long. Yes, it's nice to find layers and layers inside an illustration, like an onion. But I dont' want to look at an onion and at first think it's a pomegranate, and think that pomegranates are cool, then realize it's an onion. Am I making sense?

Hmmm. I hear you reader, but are you purporting to speak for ALL readers or just yourself? If you're speaking for yourself, fine, but remember, designers are readers too, as are, doctors, dime store employees, construction workers, and scientists. All people have differing thresholds for a presentation such as the one we're discussing, and to lump all readers into one group does them a disservice on equal par to the one of which you speak. I think, perhaps, that you need to give the reader more credit.

I too am not an editorial designer, though I am a designer, and I'm sure that those designing the pages of newspapers ARE thinking about the reader—and are probably more aware of their needs than the average reader. I think it's condescending to assume that designers are pretentious little twits with no regard for those that they serve. Designers are as diverse a group as any other.

Okay, I looked beyond the 911--a big error in my opinion. And the obscure nameplate? I think the power of the paper (as well as its design teams prowess) allows for it to do such a thing (it was done out of respect BTW, whether or not anyone else feels that way. However, I think the majority of readers would concur with their motive.) Additionally, the "READER" of the V-P will not be fooled by the diminutive nameplate and its “affront to its branding.” It is embedded in their (sub) consciousness and needn't be reinforced every morning. That move carries its own message as well. I would not have dismissed this cover as an ad. Preposterous.

In terms of its meaning…when I first saw the page, I thought of the twisted skeleton of the building that was left smoldering on the ground—an image that I think most everyone saw—not the erect towers.

Also, remember, this is NewsDesigner.com. A designer’s forum. This is what is discussed here—design. Further, whether the hash marks were done electronically or freehand is irrelevant. It’s merely opinion-worthy opinion-but opinion nonetheless. I can deal with it either way. Both have their virtues.

I have to ditto Mike and others, about the machine drawn hash marks, it just looks too … mechanical. And I think it would have had a lot more impact if it was charcol or pastel on something. I'll also ditto that the "911" distracted me becasue it's almost never written that way, it is a date.

I admit I didn't see the two towers and the "plane" going through them until it was explained, but I don't think that's a bad thing. And I don't think it's a bad thing that the meaning of the illustration isn't beaten into the readers. I think that's what makes it an even better illustration. Some people saw the WTC right away, others pondered the signifigance of the ticks, etc.

This illustration allowed readers to interpret Sept. 11, the anniversary and the illustration how they wanted, and I think that works out wonderfully.

Thank you all very much for your comments. I thought I'd answer a few of the questions posed on the thread:
I drew the lines with the pencil tool in InDesign, and I considered doing exactly what some have suggested -- using a rough, highly magnified pencil line -- but stayed with the mechanical because I felt it conveyed the architectural steel feeling of the World trade Center towers and since this was a very subtle representation, the more WTC-like I made it look, the better.
The stylistic technicality of the slash is something that I felt could be dropped on this day. Yes, 911 is the number you call for emergencies and 9/11 is the date. I think both apply, and I think most readers would agree.
Finally, I think it's important to point out that underneath the lines are the words: "World Trade Center | 2,749 killed," which should settle any confusion about the meaning of the illustration. It has a double meaning. Granted, that's a little insurance policy for those (probably many) who only saw the symbol for 5 in the illo) I frankly wanted to share with others the feeling I had myself when it dawned on me that this was a double image.
Is this pretentious? I think that's a very interesting point. Some say that a design idea should try not to be too clever or "cute." I think it's a very fine line and worthy of serious discussion. I agree with Autumn that it is the simple idea that invites readers to bring their own interpretations and subjective reactions to the table, and on this somber anniversary, I don't think that is necessarily a bad idea.
Your friend,
Sam

This is far too much navel-gazing on what is a powerfully elegant illustration for an incredibly emotional national anniversary. Simple poetry. Cannot we live with layers and interpretation? I didn't see the slash as the plane until the third look, and I wasn't offended—it stunned me. With five strokes, Hundley has provoked unique reactions for all of us—readers, designers, friends. Isn't that what a good illustration should do? My thanks to the V-P for having the chutzpah to offer it to its readers with courageous display.
Bill Marr

I "got" the symbolism of the hash marks after a few seconds pondering it, and it is quite ingenious. The fifth mark bisecting the marks like the planes did to the towers is chilling. Thinking about it for a few minutes - moving past the more obvious "marking of time" interpretation - did give it more meaning.

Some aren't into abstract, and usually I'm not either. But this was a special day and this as a front page is stunning, and far better than the run-of-the-mill ones some did - though others did a nice job while staying within conventional design standards.

The 911 without the slash to separate the dates didn't bother me much, though it IS the U.S. emergency number, and not a date. Then again, since the 911 call tapes of the passengers of the planes and the people in the top floors of the towers were long ago released, and this has become part of the narrative of that day, so this too comes to mind, even if one misunderstands them as the phone number (or was this deliberate? Who knows. It's art.)

If they ever get around to giving Pulitzers for graphic design it's going to be because work like this practically demands it. This page struck me as the finest presentation of the moment....better than the NY Times, Time, The New Yorker....everybody. Congratulations to everyone at the Virginian-Pilot for having the talent to produce it and the wisdom to run it like they did. This took my breath away.

I have my nitpicks, but they only stand out because this is so close to perfection. Why aren't we spending this kind of time on the NYT? Simple, because it's fucnctional. It doesn't suck, but it doesn't stand out like this. It doesn't break the mold of what a newspaper is, just the mold the NYT has created for itself. This is a thoughtful piece that evokes jealousy among those of us who don't have the ability to pull something like this off. The first time I looked at this all I saw was the hash marks. And that made me smile. A simple solution. Not until later did I see the towers and that just enhanced my appreciation. I didn't see the "plane" until Denise pointed it out and that's when it hit me that this was truly art.

Good for Picasso no for readers, confuse for the readership.
Good for graphic eyes, very good, but readers don't understand that, too hard.

I am neither a designer nor a journalist. I buy a newspaper only on Saturday and Sunday. When I first saw this I immediately thought how very, very interesting, how thought provoking and how creative. For me it is a brilliant cover and deserves some kind of award.

Damn brilliant idea.
I read the two buildings slashed right away. I have to disagree with everyone who would have liked to see the marks look hand-drawn. I think that would make the "buildings" even harder to see. If anything, I'd say that the four ticks should be perfect lines/rectangles, and then one hand-drawn slash. That maybe would've helped activate the slash more as well as show the buildings.
But as is, still the best page I've seen in a long time.

Tom says: Good for Picasso no for readers, confuse for the readership.
Good for graphic eyes, very good, but readers don't understand that, too hard.

Nicole says: We don't give readers enough credit.

Sam ........... You did it again ......... GREAT

First, knowing the topic, I saw the iron beams/rubble. Then I saw hash marks. Towers didn't appear to me until after I started reading here.

Either way, one word applies: Classy.

classy. simple. gorgeous. perfect.

It's a nice page. But I didn't get it. Still don't. I don't see the towers. I see ticks.

With all the powerful imagry available from that day, I just can't get past spending all that real estate on a concept like this.

I am a designer who believes in stretching the limits, giving the readers credit, finding new ways to tell stories. But this one feels more artist's conception than visual storytelling. Which is fine, for an art gallery.

Why was this needed? What information did it convey? Were there better images, maybe more evocative? What does it have to do with 9/11? How much time do I really have in the morning to ruminate over an image?

It's nice, it just doesn't give me any information.

The 9/11 page didn't work for me. The slash marks missed their mark. The tiny type was of no help, either.

The integrity of the newspaper paying for this display was compromised by the invisible (agate?) type that shows up on your web site as a kind of blur. The page must have looked like a department store wrap-around to those viewing it on the newsrack.

At a time when mainstream media seems to be under pressure (the Los Angeles Times has eliminated 40 percent of its graphic-arts staff), currently employed newspaper designers should be alert.

If you migrate to the web, please remember that most of us won't view your work on 3-foot-wide, high-defination Macintosh screens like you're probably using.

A foot-wide Dell screen is the norm. That means diaplays should be simple, clean and readable.

Newsdesigner.com should offer a way to display the pages you're discussing in a larger format. Is there a way display things with enlargable PDFs?

i am sad to read comments about a jpg. i think that the pilot didn't designed the page to be enjoyed on a tiny jpg. the page was designed to be on a paper. for a reader to hold it and grab it. to read it close, to feel the package. how many of the people that have done a critic about perceiving this page have seen it for real? are we designing for a pdf? in my opinion this package was created to comunicate emotions and reflexions of how life has changed, has anybody read the text below the image? it's a whole art product. is anybody forgeting that it doesn´t matter what we use to create (that comment about photoshop was ridiculous) but the effect that the pilot had in their readers that same morning. and i heard that they liked it.

Inspired. Brilliant.
All this talk about serving the reader - your readers are lucky. This is a sophisticated piece of work that engages them on many levels.
How many other papers would dare to clear the decks for work like this? How many papers had messages that got lost in the clutter, that would have been better served by communicating in a simple, sincere, bold way?
Congratulations to Sam, Deb, and the rest of the V-P team for pulling this off.

Look at the other 9/11 pages below. Most of them use photography in extremely powerful fashion. Mostnotably Greensboro, Hartford and KC. And the Daily News cover is much more evocative.

They are all powerful AND straightforward. I get them right away.

why is everyone dissing "art?" what's wrong with some art in a newspaper? picasso? wow. is that a wordhawk quote? i personally hate picasso's work.

the negative space give the story presence and importance. a memorial with sophistication.

i'm surprised you can't see the towers. i don't know what to tell you. it took me forever to finally see those 3d magic posters where you have to focus beyond the picture plane.

i give the v-p props for taking a risk and breaking away from showing us yet another photo of the towers. 9/11 was on everyones' mind on 9/11, we don't need to dumb everything down. is it wrong to make readers work a little?

i'm glad we're having a discussion about this. but at the same time, the discussion doesn't encourage my optimism for the future of newspapers.

Nobody has optimism for the future of newspapers. The Seattle Times employees just had to accept a two-year wage freeze. I was on the bargaining team, and it's gonna be hard to take. Some of us can't move every couple of years to find a better job and better pay. I've been in this business a long time and I don't have some of the skills that other people do. Some of us have to stick it out figure out what works to keep this industry alive.

In short, we can't just applaud everything that's different. We have to think critically and try to serve the audience as best as we can without talking down.

So maybe it's time for a real discussion about what works and what doesn't. I think here we have serious differences.

Here's what I know. The hard truth is people have much less time to devote to newspapers, and we need to start thinking about them if we want to keep this industry alive.

This doesn't make me a workdhawk A-hole. Take a look at my portfolio on newspagerdesigner (http://www.newspagedesigner.com/portfolios/portfolio1.php?UserID=201) and you can see that I take plenty of risks. I applaud risk-taking.

However, we fall all over ourselves to say this was a great piece of work, mainly I think because it's different. I see the same kind of comments on Viz Eds, and I get a sense that we've lost our critical faculties. We are forgetting what our job is.

We HAVE to think about a mass audience. I'll reluctantly say that maybe 75 percent of the people got it. That's 25 percent who didn't, and that's a lot. Nobody is putting this page on a coffee table for a long time, nobody is hanging it on a wall. It's bird-cage liner tomorrow. Fish wrap. Puppy trainer.

I think it's a gorgeous page. I don't think it was particularly effective visual journalism. It belongs in another medium.

Granted, it's applaudable high-level thinking, but I don't think it serves a general newspaper reader. And those are the ones we need to keep and/or get back.

Martin, you are an atist. Your work is brilliant. But in many ways I think newspaper designers have out-artisted themselves (to coin a new phrase). We visual journalists need to get back to the gut, the essence of visual journalism - photos, words, numbers.

Just my humble opinion.

Paul Morgan

I have optimism for the future of some newspapers.

Also, thank you for that, Nicole Bogdas.

Woah, woah, woah. Hold up here people.

This is about the future of newspapers!?!?

We're talking here about one of 365 pages produced in a whole year. From a paper who's readers have come to expect this sort of page. But that's not the issue either. Now we're accusing the Pilot of art for art's sake? I think we can all agree, and Sam confirmed it, that there was serious thought put into the publication of this page, as there is with most pages the Pilot. Norfolk is known for taking risks, occasionally, we look to them for how to do it right. I have yet to see a presentation from this paper that looks as though it was slapped together with no regard for the reader or the future of its product.

Yeah, we're all struggling with this. One day--one special day, I might add--the Pilot did a page that generated both enormous praise and enormous dissent. I can't think of a better way to use this as a tool for discussing what works and what doesn't, but let's not make this something that it's not.

Edit: should be a semicolon after the word occasionally. We don't occasionally look to them for how to do it right; they occasionally publish pages like this. Gimme a break it's early--or is it late?!!

hey paul. the picasso and wordhawk comment was a reply for "newspaper reader" and someone else up there.

what i said wasn't a diss at you or the seattle times. i totally respect you and what you do. i know things are tough up there. i keep in touch with heidi. i'm totally familiar with your work too. sorry if my comments seemed otherwise.

i think about the reader too. really. i agree on the gut / essence of visual journalism. heck, that's why i left hob. the essense to me is telling a story. but don't we have to push things forward? surprise the reader? give them something unexpected beyond the photo-headline-story model? be a little more "innovative" than "playing it safe?" we always hear people say newspapers should be more "magaziney."

ok maybe the future of newspapers comment was a tad melodramatic. i'm just saying we're dwelling on and picking apart this page (1 out of a bazillion) while we have so much more work to do. yes, it's already bird cage liner. but it does bring up a larger issue / debate.

and yes, it's not art in the traditional wall-hanging sense. newsprint is disposable media (please recycle) and the lowest / worst quality paper. can we use art to improve a narrative, explain concepts, present information and create a mood? but isn't visual journalism an art?

sorry. i was an art major. i heard from someone that someone else once said "my beret is on too tight." =( but just last week, i was told i wasn't pushing things far enough. so i dunno.

let's go hang out at a coffee shop, smoke cigarettes and talk about this sometime. =)

Paul here - again.

Thanks everybody for the comments. Believe me, I have nothing against art. Visual journalism is our field, and we have to continually ask ourselves tough questions every day about what that is and isn't.

And I didn't take anything personal from what you said, Martin. I'd love to chat sometime.

All I want to get out there is that I'm seeing less and less emphasis on and trumpeting of the little things we need to do well to tell stories and hook readers. We fall all over ourselves to lavish praise on pages that do "cool stuff" and lament the rules to which we must conform at our own papers. I think lots of designers are missing oportunities while looking for the NEXT BIG THING.

Folks, the next big thing is right in front of you. It's the centerpiece you're designing today. There's something in that story that can surprise and delight readers. A note, a quote, and interesting factoid pullout.

OK, enough from me. Back to the College Guide. Coding factboxes. Now THAT's joy.

Paul

Paul,
I'm with you, but I do find, too, that a lot of the time it's the "word people" (god I hate that phrase) that hinder what you suggest about the next big thing being what's in front of us.

There's a lot of waryness about letting a designer drive the story in such a way. Fact boxes, pull quotes, whatever--we're not qualified to judge content according to a lot of newsroom folk.

I guess it never crossed my mind that there might be people hung up on trying to get something like this done that they neglect to understand the nature of the Pilot vs. the nature of their own paper, which is key to understanding the nature of our jobs.

I actually think I've run out of things to say on this subject. Either that or the impending meeting over here has distracted my train of thought. If it's the latter, I'll be back. Mwuuu ha ha ha.

The fact that this page has generated so much discussion is a testament to its strength and ability to coax us as readers and designers further out on the limb.

What a great thing if even a fraction of our pages stirred us like this one.

I realize that many of our pages serve different purposes and delivering information quickly is a lot of what we do. That needs to be engaging, too. You're right there, Paul.

Sure, this page will soon line the litter box the same as others. But I'm betting that before it gets there, it will have stopped a lot of readers who will have found it engaging, thoughtful and, unlike so many of our pages, absolutely intriguing.

The cool thing here is that The Pilot is a paper which understands what it means to focus on telling stories every day. The front page does not look like this most of the time.

The Pilot understands very well how to serve its readers' needs. Most days, it is a paper that can be scanned by readers pressed for time and at the same time offers enough meat and potatoes (lengthy stories, strong photos, compelling illustrations, numbers and breakdowns) for the contemplative reader.

However, I think there is great value in journalism (visual or otherwise) that every once in a while looks its time-pressed readers in the eyes and says "Slow down."

Which is why this page works. Forcing readers to confront a newspaper front page with only one story, an illustration from 5 rudimentary lines, a few words, one color, no nameplate(!) is far more powerful than giving them yesterday's paper recast with different photos, headlines and stories using the same formula as every other day.

The goal should be to grab your readers by the brain and make them think about important things by writing, editing and displaying stories in a way that can't be ignored. Getting a bunch of busy people to stop what they're doing and think about one thing — even for a second — is powerful. Whether they "get it" at first glance or not.

I think this page is provocative and absolutely belongs in a newspaper. And a birdcage.

Nick

[Full disclosure] I was a design intern at The Pilot two summers ago.

Paul Morgan: Please don't stop pushing your point. Many folks -- aside from you and a few other journalists -- need to 'fess up to wronly embracing "vanity design", or layouts driven to secure an SND award, not so much for reader interest and clarity. Honestly: it's so obvious that some of you can't admit that a few readers would take this front-page presentation as a slight -- that it means no local person's photos or stories were worthy of A1 in their own local paper.

And Nicole: How can I say this gently ... Quit being such an attention glut (this isn't quite how I'd like to phrase this, BTW). Not every comment needs your rebuttal.

And as Robb's giant turd circles slowly around the punchbowl, knowing smiles are exchanged . . . Nicole, thank you very much for your comments -- I thought they were insightful and entertaining.
Sam

To everyone including the 'Robb' here who apparently has no last name - y'all that person is not me.

I did not even know about this thread until my friends sent me e-mails asking me how I could make such statements. Sorry been busy with other secret projects. I plan on personally offending you all as ususal over at my blog on visual editors.

Sorry for the interruption. Please continue bashing each other with anonymous pseudonymns.

I know you're a gentleman, Robb, unlike your doppelganger, above.
Sam

It's ok guys. I've made my peace with being an attention whore. You haven't heard the last from my big mouth.

Back to the page... I am amazed. I admit I didn't "get it" until I read the postings on it, but it struck me as soon as I saw it.

I love good, big images as much as the next person. I know we have great images from Sept. 11, but I remember those without having to see them every year. We all remember where we were and what happened. This illustration took me back to where I was when it happened.

I went to college in Norfolk and I subscribed to the Pilot while I was down there. Seeing this make me want to subscribe again.

It is just amazing. Thank you for posting it.

Oh Sam. If your work needs so much defense, it's clearly because you suck

First, I'd like to apologize for any confusion I've caused. God forbid more than one Robb exist in this tiny industry. But, more importantly, I apologize for using this site to make the following statement, because I know it's a little out of place.

Sam, don't take things personal. I think the first comment unbecoming of a gentleman on this thread was your punch bowl reference. But, since you've set precedence for such tasteless banter, here it goes: Folks, is this truly a forum for discussion on news design, or merely another opportunity for SND fiends to give each other fellatio and tummy rubs?

I can see that a few journalists here don't want a free exchange of ideas -- just more validation for those who desperately and continously seek it. How sad is that? That the journalists who supposedly embrace "thinking outside the envelope" can't read a different viewpoint without getting defensive? Or that one can't voice an unpopular but sincere thought without a mean-spirited rebuttal? Is this the way you walk into budget meetings? So eager to pass judgment on others? So dismissive toward dissension?

You don't have to like my opinion, and you don't have to like my designs. Period. Some of us prefer to stay anonymous (I'm not the only person going incognito on this thread, BTW) because some of us have jobs that, um, require real work -- not like some places that obviously let you surf the Web all day and then turn in a page one illustration that would please only a cubist.

That said, it's clear that this forum is only for those itching to give or get warm fuzzies. It's a little disappointing to see this site -- which I once perceived as far superior to newspagedesigner.com -- turns out to be a support group hiding under the thin veneer of visual journalism.

God save this profession -- before we're all replaced by designers who can also copy edit and produce multimedia presentations. The folks who "get it" -- the Baltimore Sun, Kansas City Star and Republican American -- will have the last laugh while many others are bowing their heads at the bread line.

Robb, are you Hugo Chavez?

Robb,

Hey, I'm all about the dissent here. There's nothing more boring than everyone agreeing that something's awesome. You'll note, however, that there is, in fact, dissent in this thread that was not responded to defensively (see Paul Morgan's comments, for instance). But when one drops lines like "Quit being such an attention glut" or saying someone "sucks," one shouldn't be surprised at a little pushback. That hardly means this forum is one big circle jerk. I also don't really have a problem with people remaining anonymous. But know that on the interwebs these days, anonymous posters, especially critical ones, face a much higher bar to having their comments taken seriously. Your tone really isn't helping you in that respect.

I'm totally disagree with the page ,because you forget your readership, you forget what happen if the reader is not smart enough, what happen if the reader is in hurry, the newspaper has to be fair and clear, for everyone, no Picassos, no DaVinci's, not every page is a feature page, this is a news page so, have to be clear. I like the page, but guys you look like a Club Designer Inc. Is not amazing, is not beatiful, the number not match whith nothing 911+5= 916???? what is this??? is not a gallery page is a new page, my advice, you have respect the readership. Is not you have go back to the journalist school again.

And the readers always are in hurry, so they don't loose time to 'THINK' what the designer try to tell us! for me, personal, look like a prisoner in jail, waiting for his freedom. and for a math person 911+5= 916. period.

this one doesn't really work. the text looks like a poem, and those hash marks that are supposed to be the twin towers look too hard-edged and tidy.

this feels too feature-ish and lightweight for such a weighty subject. i agree with those who have questioned the punctuation of 9.11 and the 911+5 isn't a good "headline" in any sense, whether we're going for something more conventional or trying to evoke a more contemporary voice. it just doesn't work.

it would have worked better without the 911+5, maybe just a more direct kind of headline. something in two lines, like MARKING TIME might have reinforced the image a little better. i haven't read the story, so i don't know, but i do sense a bit of design-for-design's-sake here and frankly, this page is so cold and serene for such a hot topic — i immediately feel zero emotional connection it.

Sam, buddy, you put a bow on this one! Congrats to you and your colleagues for continuing to be interesting and relevant by challenging the boring and expected. Your fire still burns bright. The page is an elegant tribute. Keep up the great work. Step away from that punchbowl.

Sue: look like you have a "Designer Club", and you are a member too, is incredible how designer forget the readers, or you have good eye or not if not you can't be a designer. Or maybe 911+5=17 I don't know what paper did that even New York Times or L.A. Times or Virginia Pilot, is a bad page.

Tom, above, kinda sums it up. Remember the reader who is benefiting/enjoying/SUPPORTING you. Make it quickly, clearly understandable. Suck readers in. Don't scare them off -- or brush them off. I agree with Tom (above).